"There are two ideas of government. There are those who believe that if you just legislate to make the well-to-do prosperous, that their prosperity will leak through on those below. The Democratic idea has been that if you legislate to make the masses prosperous their prosperity will find its way up and through every class that rests upon it.
You come to us and tell us that the great cities are in favor... I tell you that the great cities rest upon these broad and fertile prairies.
Burn down your cities and leave our farms, and your cities will spring up again as if by magic...
...but destroy our farms and the grass will grow in the streets of every city in the country."
William Jennings Bryan
the "cross of gold" speech, Chicago, 1896
8 comments:
I honestly ask, Mike, do you want a solution or do you want the conflict to escalate?
The recent posts all seem designed to questioning the reasons behind every government's move. And if not the resons, then the ways.
This "conflict" will come to an end when people "del campo" realize the government won't back down their tax decision.
But on a lighter note, here's some interesting reading for you:
Economists open blog supporting the government´s export tax policies and criticising the farmers blockades.
http://www.derf.com.ar/despachos.asp?cod_des=191023&ID_Seccion=33">http://www.derf.com.ar/despachos.asp ?cod_des=191023&ID_Seccion=33
"More than a HUNDRED ECONOMISTS opened a blog to criticize the agriculture lock-out measure, and inviting agriculture leaders to sit and have a dialogue with the government".
"In the web site, they affirm the sliding-scale export tax is a right measure to give certainty to prices and fight against inflation. It also aims to avoid the risk of an excessive concentration on soybeans, which deepens the country's external economic vulnerability and has negative effects on the rest of the agriculture production"
1896... thanks Mike, I prefer to live in a 21th century country.
FC
Mike, thanks for today´s post. Learning from the past makes us not repeat the same mistakes.
I tried to keep cool about the misinformation that was thrown in many of the comments coming from one particularly obsessed reader. But I´m fed up.
So, without calling anybody names or attacking anybody just because of his/hers condition of foreign or local, and only answering to you in English because that´s the language you chose for your blog, I´m going to point out at who is who in the more referred link I’ve seen in these comments: INFOBAE.COM
INFOBAE was founded and is owned by Daniel Hadad; it´s part of a mega media responsible of www.infobae.com, C5N among others including certain blogs. Daniel Hadad is a recognized menemist and Opus Dei follower that from being an obscure journalist came to grow his media empire with the help of some “investors” during Menem´s presidency. (guess who´s probably laughing the most behind scenes)
Regarding the mentioned economists blog economistascontralockout.blogspot.com/
I want to draw your attention to several names I found signing in favor of retentions:
1- Mario Rapoport, Director of the Institute of Research in Economic and Social History of the University of Buenos Aires (paid by the gov and admirer of Nestor Kirchner)
2-Matías Kulfas, National vice Secretary for Small Business (his aim is to promote the software industry… services, not basic production)
3-Eduardo Hecker, President of Comisión Nacional de Valores (CNV) working hand by hand in bio-diesel forums with agro-pools
4-Roberto Feletti, Vice President of Banco de la Nacion Argentina (guess who he talks for)
5-Alejandro Otero, president of the “Frente Grande en Capital” (one of the parties included in the “Frente para la Victoria” that promotes Nestor Kirchner for PJ president)
6-Oscar Tangelson, Argentina's secretary for economic policy during Nestor Kirchner presidency
7-Felisa Miceli, ex Finance Minister under Nestor Kirchner´s presidency and spouse of Ricardo “Pacha” Velasco who nowadays is a representative of the Executive branch of the gov at the “Instituto Nacional de Asociativismo” (National Institute for Asociativity)
8-Jorge Schvarzer, pro-biodiesel economist in favor of sojización and biodiesel production for exports.He said “the difference in retentions between the primary product and the biodiesel works as a transfer of the income from the soy producers that receives less income that the company who sells biodiesel”, fev 08. My short explanation: if the producer sells with 44% of retentions and the few huge (and subsidized) local oil producer companies buy grains under such conditions and, in turn sell biodiesel with a 2,5% retention, the difference makes them richer, more powerful and more concentrated; differential in retentions should be encouraged according to him.
I suggest you read and goggle these names and some other literature from other economists not so obviously making propaganda for the government. For example Ramiro Castiñeira´s at www.econometrica.com.ar , analyst at Econometrica consultancy, who forecasts the 2008 primary budget surplus at 3.2 percent of gross domestic product, without the latest tax hike. And I quote: “A 3.2 percent surplus is still much bigger than the 2007 figure. And it allows the government to easily pay debt interest payments, which represent 2 percent of GDP,". And I ask: so, what´s the rest of the money going for? More national expenses? International debt payments?
Some people writing in that blog are ex-UCR leaders and some are independent.
There are many other economists blogs as Pagina12 mentions in today’s newspaper.
But, then of course if you still prefer Goebbels-style propaganda or Himmler-style paramilitary methods, it’s up to you.
Not me. And not in my name.
99,
Thanks for the clarification on the backgrounds of some of those names flying around. I greatly appreciate it.
99, yes you discredit everyone that doesn't agree with your view because of their background and past affiliations.
Should I not take seariously anything published by InfoBAE regardless of the information source quoted on it?. You're saying now that Hadad himself (which publishes the agro-centered print magazine EL FEDERAL which criticized export taxes many times) has now converted to a K supporter overnight?. I really doubt it!.
Or is it simply that you've cornered yourself in an unsustainable position? What was the end of the "strike"?. Now that the four rural associations are getting lawsuits left and right from food distributor companies, transport companies, and even consumer associations, the agriculture sector is simply reaping the bitter seeds that it sew.
PS: The economy minister said clearly yesterday that meat exports are not blocked, it was simply that the resolution authorizing a number of exports had lapsed, and that he'll sign a new one even INCREASING meat exports.
Does INFOCAMPO, an agro news site, fit your bill for an "independent news source"?
Here's the story:
Fue sólo un susto administrativo: siguen abiertas las exportaciones de carne
http://www.infocampo.com.ar/generales/13190-fue-solo-un-susto-administrativo-siguen-abiertas-las-exportaciones-de-carne/
"Just an administrative scare: meat exports remain open"
Question for 99: Wasn't the point of all this "strike" a supposed concern about the interests of small and medium sized farmers?.
If so, doesn't the government announced measures of paying 50% of the shipment cost for the remote areas from the BsAs ports, tax benefits and others (which will be discussed with the four agro associations going forward), address and highly benefit those small producers that you say you were defending?.
You shouldn't be suprised that regular people along with unions and others affected by the lack of food in the cities filled the plaza.
Are you denying the violence, threats, intimidation on the part of the agro piqueteros??
And yes, if you want to name me, name me, I don't have a problem.
FC
99 said: "But, then of course if you still prefer Goebbels-style propaganda"
A perfect ecample of Godwin's law
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law
which states "As a Usenet discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches one.""
And then you say "... or Himmler-style paramilitary methods"
Do you refer to these ones by the likes of "the Ingalls family" (Little House on a Praire) all peaceful rural people who don't want to harm no one?
Ruralists attack railroads
http://news.google.com.ar/news/url?sa=t&ct=es_ar/0-0&fp=47f30e734be17c36&ei=u8TzR7a3KpC6ygTy0NXhCg&url=http%3A//www.derf.com.ar/despachos.asp%3Fcod_des%3D189345%26ID_Seccion%3D33&cid=0&usg=AFrqEzczi96GT-X9JSfSYxXRnrS5xFgGWQ
SANTIAGO DEL ESTERO / Piqueteros ruralistas BALEAN UN MICRO
http://translate.google.com/translate?prev=/language_tools&u=http://www.26noticias.com.ar/santiago-del-estero-piqueteros-ruralistas-balearon-un-micro-62606.html
La Pampa: driver attacked at a road blockade by farmers
http://translate.google.com/translate?prev=/language_tools&u=http://www.derf.com.ar/despachos.asp?cod_des=190015&ID_Seccion=42
Brutal assault on driver in San Francisco, Cordoba
http://translate.google.com/translate?prev=/language_tools&u=http://www2.lavoz.com.ar/08/03/22/secciones/economia/nota.asp?nota_id=173910
Gunfire in Southern Santa Fe against those who don't want to stop
http://news.google.com.ar/news/url?sa=t&ct=es_ar/3-0&fp=47f3bbeb34896015&ei=_sbzR_bgFI2KyQSPusThCg&url=http%3A//www.impulsobaires.com.ar/nota.php%3Fid%3D45009&cid=0&usg=AFrqEzdOcMHEeXIRMuaW5jGd4niR2ug0RQ
He died after being delayed at a producers' road blockade
http://translate.google.com/translate?prev=/language_tools&u=http://www2.lavoz.com.ar/08/03/26/secciones/economia/nota.asp?nota_id=174941
(99: I eliminated the INFOBAE links, since you say it's an untrusted news source, and replaced with others reporting on the same facts).
FC
99: I´m not obsessed just stating a different point of view. That´s what democracy is all about, right?.
FC
With all due respect, I think we should all be highly sceptical of the views of any Argentine economist given the country's economic track record. Especially one currently or formerly affiliated with the Argentine government. Even more especially when his or her views are inconsistent with the views of most economists elsewhere around the world.
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